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  #1  
Old 07-17-2008, 05:20 PM
Mark Walsen (markwa)
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Default Hello Notation Composer and Mu

Hello Notation Composer and Musician Users,

If you are using Notation Composer or Musician version 2.0 through 2.4.2, you are highly encouraged to update to version 2.5. You can review the version number of Composer or Musician by using the About command in the Help menu.

Visit the following web page for a description of the feature enhancements and bug fixes in the various releases 2.0 up to 2.4.2 and for instructions for updating to the latest version 2.5:

http://notation.com/ComposerWebUpdate.php

or

http://notation.com/MusicianWebUpdate.php

Cheers
-- Mark
  #2  
Old 07-18-2008, 04:04 AM
Clyde (clyde)
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Default Hi, I have done each of th

Hi,
I have done each of the updates since v2.2 and tried to run them and they load OK, but I find that each of them crashes or does something unexpectedly within the first few minutes of trying them. So I am still running on version 2.2

I tried the new 2.5 today, and again disappointment that many of the persistent bugs with the piano roll are still there, but more concerned that when replaying from somewhere in the score, there is a significant wait, and then the timing of the replay is totally wrong.

So back to a reload of version 2.2

Clyde
  #3  
Old 07-18-2008, 04:55 AM
Mark Walsen (markwa)
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Default Hello Clyde, Version 2.5 fi

Hello Clyde,

Version 2.5 fixes a lot of bugs. This is the most significant bug-fix release Notation Software has ever issued. It represents many months of solid bug-fixing. We postponed further development of the 3.0 versions of our products in order to improve the baseline software quality of the products.

I'm absolutely confident that version 2.5 is of significant higher software quality than previous versions of the product. I know that because we have significantly whittled down the bug count in our bug database.

If you're "stuck" way back on version 2.2, I'm wondering whether maybe your Notation .not files are somehow locked into that old version and are incompatible with more recent versions. If you export your song from version 2.2 into a MIDI file, and then open that MIDI file in version 2.5, do you still see a problem? If not, then that would tend to confirm the theory that there is some version 2.2 versus later version file compatibility problem that I'm now aware of (but perhaps could fix).

Please send us a report of the piano roll bug(s) you ran into in version 2.5. You can send that to support@notation.com; or post it in the piano roll section of this forum; or, less optimally, post it below here.

Please take a look at the new lyrics support in 2.5. Since you're really into lyrics, I think you'll like how each verse of lyrics is separately highlighted during playback, with also better quality of display.

I hope everthing is going well with your http://www.jazzworship.com work!

Cheers
-- Mark
  #4  
Old 07-18-2008, 05:40 AM
Clyde (clyde)
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Default Hi Mark, Thank you for you

Hi Mark,
Thank you for your comments. I shall try what you suggested on the next song I do this afternoon and let you know how I get on.

I've moved on from the jazzworship.com site to the smallchurchmusic.com site where I actually do all (or most of the playing). This is mainly pipe organ music, but recently I have been doing some piano and organ duets (with myself), and these have been very popular.
(Typical one is at: http://www.smallchurchmusic.com/MP3/...an-128-CAM.mp3 - still learning how to record the piano sound better etc ). The site is proving to be popular with about 60,000 downloads per month from over 95 countries. I have recorded over 1,200 hymns (on the organ) and currently do about 3 or 4 a day. Of course Composer piano roll features are an integral part of all that for correcting my playing mistakes, and none of this would be possible without Composer - there is nothing like it on the market.

In regard to plain scores, I've recently been adding the score of the music (with lyrics at the bottom of the page) to the site. I've been also adding the chord names (courtesy of Composer). Typical of these scores is http://www.smallchurchmusic.com/Scor...-FesteBurg.pdf. All this of course, uses the score entry facilities and text handling, page formatting etc.

Through all this daily usage, I am still spending at least 8 hours a day with Composer, and so am fully aware of its 'foibles', and look forward to their elimination.

Cheers ... Clyde
  #5  
Old 07-18-2008, 06:11 AM
Clyde (clyde)
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Default Hi Mark, Just a further co

Hi Mark,
Just a further comment about Church music these days, and the way they print the music. I have attached a PDF file of 'A Mighty Fortress' from a recently published hymn book.

<center><table border=1><tr><td>PDF
AMightyFortress.pdf (286.1 k)</td></tr></table></center>
Its interesting about the time signatures (and I don't think Composer handles this):
(a) There are two time signatures at the beginning.
(b) You will notice that the number of beats in the bar change without notice
(c) And of course, to make matters worse, there are further time signature changes throughout the music.

Cheers ... Clyde
  #6  
Old 07-18-2008, 07:19 AM
M G Jacobs (mgj32)
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Default Hi Mark, I think this belon

Hi Mark,

I think this belongs in another thread, but I'm too tired to try to figure out which. The enclosed file stops playing at the end of measure 42. Just stops. In a moment some of the notes palette icons that were grayed out become bold. However, playing does not resume. You can select the first note in the next measure, and play will start from there.

I had an abnormal program termination earlier, but it is one of those many that happen once but will not repeat. That was not at this point in this draft--a couple of measures before, actually.

Hoping the problems happens there, because I'm totally baffled, not having done anything out of the ordinary.

<center><table border=1><tr><td>new piece
New Piece.not (241.8 k)</td></tr></table></center>

all best,
mgj
  #7  
Old 07-18-2008, 07:22 AM
Clyde (clyde)
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Default Hi Mark, The results of usi

Hi Mark,
The results of using a V2.5 only files is as not good. I think the culprit is somewhere in the paste command (qpxm), as it was going OK until then.

The NOT file is attached:

<center><table border=1><tr><td>Not file
JosephDearesr-Laudibus-PipeLC-CAM.not.zip (117.3 k)</td></tr></table></center>

Note also that the the bar brackets cannot be highlighted or selected to deleted or change them (there is an additional bracket in the file).

The process I went through to make his file was:

(a) I played it on my Clavinova, and it produced a midi file (on a USB).
(b) Read the midi file from the USB in v 2.5
(c) Edited the file for basic faults.
(d) Added the bass line (ex my C++ program to create the pedal line.)
(e) Took my V2.2 template file (for bar 1) and saved it as a midi, then reloaded it to save as anew V2.5 template.
(f) Then added the basic file to the template (paste special)
(g) The highlighted bars 2 to the end (21 at this stage) and pasted the main song 8 times (for the eight verses).
(h) At this stage when I tried to play it, it would hang, or play quickly.

I restarted Composer and it still happened.
I also saved it as a midi file, and it still wouldn't play correctly.
When I tried to shut down the OS, it seemed to behave strangely.
Restarted the O/S (Windows XP) and the NOT file would still not play properly.

Cheers ... Clyde
  #8  
Old 07-18-2008, 07:35 AM
Clyde (clyde)
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Default Hi Mark, Have restored ba

Hi Mark,
Have restored back to version 2.2, and it was able to process the file OK, and played fine. I was also able to edit the bracket, etc.

So I will stay with version 2.2 for a while longer.

Cheers ... Clyde
  #9  
Old 07-18-2008, 11:58 AM
Herbert WENDE (herbert)
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Default Hi Mark, Now on Composer 2.

Hi Mark,

Now on Composer 2.5, I have lost the content, of the little window on the info line, indicating the note value such as “Bb3”. This was a very useful recent addition. Can I please have it back?

Best wishes,

Herbert
  #10  
Old 07-18-2008, 03:07 PM
Djim Tio (djimtio)
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Default Hi Mark Load any song in Comp

Hi Mark
Load any song in Composer/Musician 2.5
SETUP---Staff setup---select drums---Composer/musician freezes up and I have to terminate the whole session and start over again.
Regards
Djim
  #11  
Old 07-18-2008, 04:19 PM
Mark Walsen (markwa)
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Default Hello Djim, I was able to r

Hello Djim,

I was able to reproduce the problem you reported in Composer 2.5:
  1. Open a MIDI file.
  2. Choose the Setup command in the Staff menu.
  3. Select a non-drum staff.
  4. Try to add a checkmark to the Drum Instrument [ ] checkbox.
Indeed, Composer 2.5 hangs at this point.

I'll fix this soon in a Composer 2.5.1 maintenance release. The problem was newly introduced in Composer 2.5; it is not a bug in 2.4.2.

For now, you can easily work around the problem. Instead of using the Setup command in the Staff menu, use the Staff Setup button that is displayed when you choose View / Staff Controls. The resulting "single staff setup" dialog box also has a Drum Instrument [ ] check box, and it works without any problem.

Thanks for reporting this problem, Djim!

[Note to myself and Sherry: task #1784]

Cheers
-- Mark
  #12  
Old 07-18-2008, 04:26 PM
Mark Walsen (markwa)
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Default Hi Herbert, I have confirme

Hi Herbert,

I have confirmed the problem you reported:<blockquote><hr size=0><!-quote-!><font size=1>quote:</font>

Now on Composer 2.5, I have lost the content, of the little window on the info line, indicating the note value such as “Bb3”. This was a very useful recent addition. Can I please have it back?<!-/quote-!><hr size=0></blockquote>It was newly introduced in 2.5, not a problem in 2.4.2. I'll fix in the next 2.5.1 maintenance release.

Thanks for reporting this problem.

[Note to myself and Sherry: task #1785]

Cheers
-- Mark
  #13  
Old 07-18-2008, 04:43 PM
Mark Walsen (markwa)
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Default Hello Clyde, Thanks for the

Hello Clyde,

Thanks for the carefully prepared sets of steps for reproducing the paste problem with JosephDearesr-Laudibus-PipeLC-CAM.not in Composer 2.5.

When I opened that Notation .not file in a debugging version of Composer 2.5, I observed a problem with file compatibility, which might be consistent with my previously stated theory about file incompatibility between version 2.2 and later versions. As you suspect, perhaps the paste command is also involved.

In order to investigate this further, it would help a lot if you you send me: (1) your originally recorded MIDI file, and (2) the version 2.2 template file that you used.

I think the problem might be with the version 2.2 template file. I can investigate that here. However, if you feel like doing so, you might try the same steps that you reported above, except don't use any template file or any Notation .not file that passed through version 2.2. More specifically, just use a new 2.5 template file, for testing purposes, even though it isn't the template you really want. This will help me isolate whether the problem is with (1) file incompatibility and/or (2) pasting.

Thanks!

Cheers
-- Mark
  #14  
Old 07-18-2008, 05:06 PM
Mark Walsen (markwa)
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Default Hello Clyde, Thanks for sho

Hello Clyde,

Thanks for showing the example of the Either/Or time signature. That practice has been used for a long time (I don't know how many decades or centuries).

For now, there might be a way to fake such Either/Or meters in Composer. Part of the solution would be to take advantage of Composer's support for hiding meters. The other part of the problem is adding the "ambiguous" meter text, such as 2:2|3:2. You could add the second meter using Composer's free text feature. But this is admittedly just a work-around, not a happy solution.

I'm add this "ambiguous meter" to the wish list for a future version of Composer. [Task #1786]


Cheers
-- Mark
  #15  
Old 07-18-2008, 05:18 PM
Mark Walsen (markwa)
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Default Hello MG, I confirmed the p

Hello MG,

I confirmed the problem that playback in your file prematurely stopped before the end of the song.

This is a serious problem, which is more generally the following: If you add new measures to the end of the song, during playback Composer prematurely stops at the old end of the song.

For now you can work around this problem as follows:
  1. Choose the Edit Repetitions command in the Measure menu. Notice that the repeat instructions incorrectly tell Composer to stop playing at your old last measure of the song.
  2. In the Repeat Instructions dialog box, click the Use Default button. That resets the instructions to play to the new end of song.
  3. Exit the Repeat Instructions dialog box by clicking OK.
Thanks for reporting this problem. I'll fix this soon in a 2.5.1 maintenance release. [Task #1787]

Cheers
-- Mark
  #16  
Old 07-18-2008, 06:43 PM
M G Jacobs (mgj32)
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Default Hi Mark, Thanks. I'll

Hi Mark,

Thanks. I'll use the work-around.

Regarding abnormal terminations: I seem to have been getting quite a few, only one of which I could repeat, but you or Sherry couldn't repeat it. Most are one-time things. However, quite a bit of work can be lost, depending on how long since the last auto save (now set at 2 minutes). So I was wondering (hoping)is there any way that clicking OK on the abnormal termination box could trigger a mandatory save before the program shuts down?

One more question. What would be the shortest interval auto save could be set to without slowing down Composer? At 2 minutes, I notice no slowing at all.

all best,
mgj
  #17  
Old 07-19-2008, 12:39 AM
Clyde (clyde)
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Default Hi Mark, I have attached t

Hi Mark,
I have attached the original midi file as it came from the clavinova.
<center><table border=1><tr><td>Original
USERSONG02.MID (1.9 k)</td></tr></table></center>

In regard to the template, I loaded that into the 2.5 and saved it as a midi file, and then reloaded/saved it in 2.5 as a template.

Here is the 2.5 version that I actually used.

<center><table border=1><tr><td>template
Organ.not (65.9 k)</td></tr></table></center>

Throughout this whole process, there was no use of v2.2, and the only file from 2.2 was the original template, which I resaved.

When I run 2.5 it does disastrous things to my O/S, which involves a lot of messing around to fix (reload 2.2, reconfigure midi setup etc) and at this time I have higher priority jobs that I'm working on (took several hours yesterday). I can live with v2.2 (even though every day I get frustrated by its piano score bugs).

Cheers ... Clyde
  #18  
Old 07-19-2008, 06:13 AM
M G Jacobs (mgj32)
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Default Hi Mark, Just a couple of t

Hi Mark,

Just a couple of things. One of them, implemented in earlier versions, was the ability to hold the mouse pointer over notes as the file played and see the note velocities. That is still missing in the current version.

In one version, quite far back I think, starting playback deep into a large file required a wait of several seconds for the sound to start. That seems to be back in this version.

Overall, it's working very nicely, though.

all best,
mgj
  #19  
Old 07-19-2008, 07:36 PM
Sherry Crann (sherry)
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Default Howdy Clyde, For informatio

Howdy Clyde,

For informational purposes, what system were you running 2.5 on? I recall that you were planning to go to a Mac, running Parallels for your Windows applications. Is that what you're currently using? If not, what is your system setup?

Thanks!
Sherry
  #20  
Old 07-20-2008, 05:43 PM
Mark Walsen (markwa)
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Default Hello Clyde, Thanks for sen

Hello Clyde,

Thanks for sending me your USERSONG02.MID and Organ.not template files. I have indeed found some problems with Edit / Paste Special / Insert New Measures from Clipboard. Perhaps that feature became broken after version 2.2, which explains why you have particularly wanted to stay back on 2.2, which in most respects is inferior to more recent versions in terms of software quality and usability.

I will work on this Edit / Paste Special / Insert New Measures from Clipboard bug for the next 2.5.1 maintenance release, which is tentatively scheduled for about 7 to 10 days from now.

Cheers
-- Mark
  #21  
Old 07-20-2008, 09:08 PM
Mark Walsen (markwa)
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Default Hello Clyde, The Edit / Pas

Hello Clyde,

The Edit / Paste Special / Insert New Measures from Clipboard bug you reported is now fixed for the upcoming 2.5.1 maintenance release. Thanks for reporting it!

<blockquote><hr size=0><!-quote-!><font size=1>quote:</font>

When I run 2.5 it does disastrous things to my O/S, which involves a lot of messing around to fix (reload 2.2, reconfigure midi setup etc) <!-/quote-!><hr size=0></blockquote>It's difficult for me to interpret the scope of "when I run 2.5 it does disastrous things to my O/S." Did that happen just for this Edit / Paste Special / Insert New Measures from Clipboard bug? Or were there other cases?

Notation Composer has some robust internal safeguards against "disastrous things" happening. Composer indeed does have internal bugs, like any complex software, but it catches such accidents on the highway and immediately moves the damage off the highway before there is a chain reaction, pile up, of cars crashes behind it. I wonder whether Composer's safeguard mechanism does not work under the Mac/Apple Parallels that you, but very few other Notation Composer uses. Please Note: Notation Software does not claim to support the running of its product on Mac/Apple Parallels. I do not even have a Mac machine here, so absolutely no testing of Notation products is done on the Mac / Parallels.

Do you have an old PC lying around with Windows 98 or later on it? If so, you might want to try out Notation Composer version 2.5 on it, to see whether it works better than Notation Composer on your Mac.

You and a few other rare users that use Notation Composer on the Mac might force me to invest a lot of time testing Notation Composer on the Mac / Parallels. But I'm afraid that will be a poor way to spend my development time.

Cheers
-- Mark
  #22  
Old 07-21-2008, 06:37 AM
M G Jacobs (mgj32)
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Default Hi Mark, Here is a runtime

Hi Mark,

Here is a runtime error abnormal program termination I was able to repeat several times.

Go the last measure, that last two notes, piano RH.
Use D and left arrow to make the first G a 16th note.
Delete the second G5 and replace it with an 8th note on the rest following the first G, now a 16th note.
Hit D and right arrow to make the inserted G a dotted 8th note.
It winks out at this point.

all best,
mgj

<center><table border=1><tr><td>new piece
New Piece.not (258.1 k)</td></tr></table></center>
  #23  
Old 07-21-2008, 05:03 PM
Mark Walsen (markwa)
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Default Hello MG, Beautiful report

Hello MG,

Beautiful report of this D+RightArrow bug! I was able to reproduce the bug the first time. That's one of the best reports you've sent. Thanks a bunch. It's just what I need to fix this bug, which I'll promptly do for the upcoming 2.5.1 release.

Cheers
-- Mark
  #24  
Old 07-21-2008, 05:16 PM
Mark Walsen (markwa)
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Default Hello MG, The above bug 

Hello MG,

The above bug (D+RightArrow at end of song) is now fixed for the upcoming 2.5.1 release, due within a week.

Thanks again for the very helpful bug report! (See the timestamps on these posts, and you'll notice how quickly I was able to fix it, given your good report.)

Cheers
-- Mark
  #25  
Old 07-28-2008, 05:31 AM
M G Jacobs (mgj32)
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Default Hi Mark, Please go to staff

Hi Mark,

Please go to staff setup and try to move the Soprano Solo staff down so that it appears just above the Tenor Solo staff. Click OK, then go back to the score. You should find it un-moved.

It will be correct, however, in the Conductor's Score, just not in the screen score.

all best,
mgj

<center><table border=1><tr><td>example zipped
Symphony 3 (184.5 k)</td></tr></table></center>
  #26  
Old 08-01-2008, 05:10 PM
Daniel Vallery (danielv)
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Default I have a problem to report: W

I have a problem to report:
When I start a new .not file with a time signature of 4/4, 2/2, C, or cut time, the file, during playback, will always stop at the 16th measure, 4th beat, and will not play any measures after, even if you click in them. I've done this many times:
1. Start a new .not file.
2. Choose any template.
3. Choose the 4/4, 2/2, C, or cut time meter. Any other meter does not have this problem, only meters that contain 4 quarter notes per measure. Also, change the note groupings does not help the problem.
4. Choose any key.
5. Choose any title, or none at all.
6. Push play, go to the 16th measure. Play back stops at the 16th measure, 4th beat, even though the playback button is still down.

The only work around I could find was to make a new file in 2/4, then manually change the meter to 4/4 or whatever else you want. After changing from 2/4, the playback does not stop at the 16th measure, but plays as usual.

~Daniel
  #27  
Old 08-01-2008, 06:21 PM
Mark Walsen (markwa)
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Default Hello Daniel, In version 2.

Hello Daniel,

In version 2.5, some work was done in the area of repeats, but a bug was introduced that has the symptom you have described, that playback stops prematurely.

For now, you can work around the problem as follows:
  1. In the Measure menu, choose the Edit Repetition Instructions command.
  2. In the Repeat Instructions dialog box, click the Use Default button, and then the OK button.

This problem will be fixed in the upcoming 2.5.1 maintenance release.

Cheers
-- Mark
  #28  
Old 08-02-2008, 06:07 PM
Jeffrey Allen Frady (jazzv)
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Default Mark, Ever since I installe

Mark,

Ever since I installed Musician 2.5, I've been having a problem with lag during tracks, especially on drum-heavy tracks. The rhythm ends up choppy. I'll attach a midi file. I saved this as a .not file, but it was too large to post.

I never had this issue with the 2.4 series.

Thanks,

Jeff
<center><table border=1><tr><td>File 1 Midi
Good_Don't_Last.mid (141.2 k)</td></tr></table></center>
  #29  
Old 08-02-2008, 08:11 PM
Sherry Crann (sherry)
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Default Howdy Jeff, Thanks for this

Howdy Jeff,

Thanks for this report, and the included file. I'm seeing the same problem in 2.5 (and not in 2.4.2), so I'm writing this up so we can find and fix the problem.

Thanks!
Sherry
  #30  
Old 08-02-2008, 08:46 PM
Jeffrey Allen Frady (jazzv)
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Default Thanks, Sherry. I'm gla

Thanks, Sherry.

I'm glad to hear it's not my imagination (or my computer). I tried this file in a couple of other programs, and it worked fine. If it helps, I'm running Vista with a Soundblaster X-Fi. I tried it with various soundfonts, and it made no real difference. Other files I've used are seeing similar issues, though they don't seem quite as obvious since they're at a slower tempo.

Thanks again,

Jeff
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