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  #1  
Old 05-31-2006, 04:47 PM
Tim Fatchen (flyingtadpole)
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Default This is a wonderful piece of s

This is a wonderful piece of software. For those poor souls who think they got troubles, attend to this!!!

Ourlocal Mountain Theatre Company, for their first production, headed for "The Gondoliers" to get bums on seats and generate some money! but: the first musical director vanished taking with him the pianist. The next accompanist got dragged from the piano to take on a singing role (shortage of men!). The options: a terrible karaoke effort using existing recordings (which the Company couldnt afford, being both new and broke given the crippling financial burden of appalling public liability insurance in Australia)? or a DIY purpose-arranged score designed for a small company and recorded from scratch? No real choice there! Midinotate to the rescue!

Here's how it worked. The Gilbert & Sullivan Archive (Boise, Idaho) has MIDI vocal scores available in the public domain, which cuts a lot of time and effort otherwise needed for direct keyboard entry (but that could have been done if needed). So we gratefully used their midi scores as the starting point.

In real time, and with Midinotate Composer up on the screen, the Director and I spent several harrowing hours changing tempos, putting in appropriate breaks, shortening some pieces, changing the emphasis and volume of the raw MIDI files. Then recording, as piano, onto CD.

That MIDI piano rendition, which sounded pretty terrible, was used as early rehearsal backing track while I started the scoring. The idea, which worked, was that the scored (orchestrated) backing track would have identical tempo, pauses, breaks etc to the rehearsal track.

THe scoring was based on what one might hope for in a local orchestra/band: a couple of keyboards, one to handle piano and the other to substitute for strings, a clarinet, a flute, a bass (guitar or acoustic), and a sparingly used trumpet. With a couple of people on triangles, tambourines, snare drum and bass drum as needed. While the orchestration was mental agony, the mechanics of it were an absolute breeze, simple staff setup in Composer, simple cuts and pastes, volume, pan changes etc etc. Bear in mind this is for an hour and a half of music!

And lots of playing and replaying, with little tweaks along the way, especially in attack and duration of notes. It's easy to tweak in Composer. eg, the cheapie Medeli keyboard I'm currently using has lovely brass, but one has to persuade the MIDI notes to play as if they were coming through a trumpet. This is pretty well impossible to do in just about everyother notation program I've tried, but it's not only possible but simple in COmposer because of the varied attack and duration approaches and the simple note selection.

I had a month's notice to do the actual orchestration before the full rehearsals cut in and I cut out (for Europe, planned long since. WOuld have been Ok had I not been working 70 hour weeks at the day'n'night job. Not only would I never have done it without Midinotate, I would never have contemplated even starting it!!!!

Here's part of the score. Some will detect a bit of cheating in places. To hear what it sounded like on the intended keyboard (as distinct from whatever soundcard you're running, the same segment is up as streamable/downloadable mp3 on http://www.soundclick.com/flyingtadpole
<center><table border=1><tr><td>Gondoliers finale (karaoke!) excerpt
o212ex.not (491.0 k)</td></tr></table></center>

Tim Fatchen
http://www.music.download.com/timfatchen
http://www.music.download.com/internetopera
http://www.soundclick.com/flyingtadpole
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  #2  
Old 05-31-2006, 05:40 PM
Mark Walsen (markwa)
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Default Hello Tim, What a great pro

Hello Tim,

What a great project you did!

You basically used MidiNotate Composer as a MIDI sequencer, to customize the MIDI arrangement of, wow, 1-1/2 hours of Gilbert and Sullivan's Gondoliers. Many folk use MidiNotate Composer to produce the score, and use the sound as an audit to make sure the score is right. You did it the other way. You used MidiNotate Composer to produce the sound, and used that notation to help you see what you were doing with the music. It probably didn't matter to you that the score was far from perfectly notated, as you weren't handing out parts, because you didn't have the musicians to play them.

I'm so pleased that you found MidiNotate Composer useful this way. You're at the forefront of MidiNotate Composer users who have discovered the MIDI sequencing/arranging features of the software.

Congratulations on your musical accomplishment, as well as technical accomplishment using MidiNotate Composer.

Gilbert and Sullivan. What fun!

Cheers
-- Mark
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  #3  
Old 06-01-2006, 06:25 AM
Tim Fatchen (flyingtadpole)
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Default


<blockquote><hr size=0><!-quote-!><font size=1>quote:</font>

It probably didn't matter to you that the score was far from perfectly notated, as you weren't handing out parts, because you didn't have the musicians to play them.<!-/quote-!><hr size=0></blockquote>

Indeed. I started off in Act 1 properly notating and cleaning up, then realised (a) not producing sheet music (singers all had their vocal score copies too) and especially (B) I really, really needed to be able to see where phrasing, staccato, attacks needed modification. i find it easier to do (b) using notation, which I can read fast and without conscious thought, rather than the piano-roll which isn't "hardwired" in my brain!

So in the developing a useable performance as distinct from a readable score, I had to go back into the first 30minutes of music, wipe out all that lovely clean notation and make it go back to a forest of hemidemisemiquavers and their rests Fortunately that's a fast and simple thing to do in Composer also!

(All this is a loooong way beyond most packages' limited "quantize" commands. BTW, the Director was staggered at how easy it was to very tempos using the graphical tools.)

However, to demonstrate that I can be neat if required, here is a CLEAN notation version of the last 42 bars of my arrangement, which can be compared with the file uploaded in the previous post. I did it as an exercise after reading your post: time to clean up, 2 minutes flat. I admit I haven't put in expression or other player directions, but if I were handing out to a band, these are likely to be pencilled in and changed to fit the singers (who change also!). Performance is the same as before, only the notaiton has changed. Hear it on the SOundclick.com URL below
<center><table border=1><tr><td>Gondoliers finale in clean notation
o212ex2.not (153.7 k)</td></tr></table></center>
Tim Fatchen
http://www.music.download.com/timfatchen
http://www.music.download.com/internetopera
http://www.soundclick.com/flyingtadpole
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  #4  
Old 06-01-2006, 06:32 AM
Tim Fatchen (flyingtadpole)
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Default Oops. Obviously I should have

Oops. Obviously I should have taken 5 seconds at the beginning of my 2 minute exercise to switch off the match attack and duration to notation button! Performance of the clean notation has altered because I failed to do so. Mea culpa.

Tim Fatchen
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  #5  
Old 06-01-2006, 12:19 PM
David Jacklin (dj)
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Default Hi, Tim: 1) My god! Th

Hi, Tim:

1) My god! The group's first effort and they do The Gondoliers! To put bums on seats? Wow. I'da gone with The Music Man.

2) Music directors running off with pianists. Oh, if I had a nickel . . .

3) What perseverence on your part. As Mark said, I use Composer the other way around, to create the scores for others to play, but to create "human" sounding playback for the complete score to The Gondoliers. Wow.

4) Yeah, the G&amp;S archive is great. If the group is looking for a smaller show that is a real barn-burner, look at Cox &amp; Box. It's 50 minutes long, 3 people, Sullivan but not Gilbert, and more fun that a barrel of monkeys. And, it puts bums on seats.

David
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  #6  
Old 06-01-2006, 03:32 PM
Tim Fatchen (flyingtadpole)
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Default David, have to say: it did get

David, have to say: it did get bums on seats, and it did make significant money. The public liability insurance problem in Australia is no joke. There are community fetes, agricultural shows, flower shows, craft shows, markets, theatre groups, you name, that have all vanished because they can't find the (literally) thousands of dollars needed for liability insurance for each. Indeed, to meet the advance payment, the Director and the Publicity Officer desperately flogged off trash'n'treasure at every boot sale in the region for months beforehand!!!

So what's this got to do with Midinotate? Simple. Mountain Theatre Co. couldn't afford royalties for a first production. G&amp;S is out of copyright, yes, but all recordings (eg D'Oyly Carte) are still in copyright. Even a couple hundred dollars was too much. No pianist: fled with the original musical director, and the second pressganged into singing. No karaoke recording, cost too much. I was a member and had the software I knew could do it. Voila! No financial cost (tho' I'm going to be now jealously guarding my own copyright on the arrangement &amp; recordings)

And I'm now formally persuing Aspects of Love for possible production in 2008, not necessarily with the same company. I haven't died of terror yet tho' I'm losing weight fast...question will be whether I can orchestrate it myself or whether performance agreements will demand Lloyd Webber's orchestration only. Either way, Midinotate will cope!

Tim Fatchen
http://www.music.download.com/timfatchen
http://www.music.download.com/internetopera
http://www.soundclick.com/flyingtadpole
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  #7  
Old 06-02-2006, 12:39 PM
David Jacklin (dj)
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Default Hi, Tim: I know Composer ca

Hi, Tim:

I know Composer can do it: I used the betas of Composer 1.0 to develop orchestrations for a musical of mine for 23 pieces and a big cast. It did the job. Now that we're approaching 2.0, I'm sure it'll handle it even better.

I'd think you'd be stuck with renting orchestrations for Aspects Of Love. Another local company hired me to do what exactly what you've been doing for their production of The Secret Garden. I created an audio CD from the score for them to sing to, although The Secret Garden was a tough show to "karaoke". I suspect Aspects Of Love would be more so.

Our current show is simplicity itself in comparison: 6 actors, 1 pianist, 30-some rag-time and blues numbers -- with arrangements done in Composer, of course!

Keep us informed on how it goes.

David
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  #8  
Old 06-02-2006, 12:43 PM
David Jacklin (dj)
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Default P.S. Interesting to note ab

P.S.

Interesting to note about the liability insurance thing. It's not really a problem here in Canada for small groups, although I've heard of a couple of major events being cancelled, and I wonder what the difference is.

I also wonder how long until it becomes a problem here.

As our local building inspector once told me: "The best way to stop people from being burned in large numbers is to prevent them from gathering in large numbers." That's what he saw as his job.

David
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  #9  
Old 07-26-2006, 04:34 AM
Moray Nairn (moray)
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Default David - sorry this is slightly

David - sorry this is slightly off topic, but I am looking into producing "The Secret Garden" for a local amateur group in the UK and would be interested in talking with you about your accompaniments.

Not sure if you can see my e-mail on my profile here - if so, please feel free to get in touch. I am out of the country at the moment on vacation but will pick up my e-mails soon.

Apologies to all if this is a bad use of the forum, but I couldn't see any other way to get in touch - and it is "sort of " relevant!!!

Moray Nairn
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  #10  
Old 07-26-2006, 04:38 AM
Mark Walsen (markwa)
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Default Hello Moray, No problem at

Hello Moray,

No problem at all using the forum for collaborating with other musicians. We love to see folk making music!

Cheers
-- Mark
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  #11  
Old 07-26-2006, 04:42 AM
Sherry Crann (sherry)
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Default Howdy Moray, Now that you&#

Howdy Moray,

Now that you've told us what you're doing, you have to tell us how it goes ;)

Actually, this is a big part of what the forum is all about - musicians connecting with other musicians and helping each other out. So it's a good use

And we really do like to hear about what you're doing! Someone else may want to contact you for advice

ttfn,
Sherry
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  #12  
Old 07-26-2006, 02:19 PM
David Jacklin (dj)
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Default Hi, all: I've emailed M

Hi, all:

I've emailed Moray off forum. The Secret Garden has some of the most beautiful music I've ever worked with, but it's FIENDISHLY difficult.
Think Stephen Sondheim meets Ravi Shankar.

David
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  #13  
Old 07-26-2006, 04:07 PM
Sherry Crann (sherry)
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Default Howdy, You guys keep teasin

Howdy,

You guys keep teasing us with this stuff - it sounds (pun intended) intriguing! Any chance we'll get to hear any of it? Excerpts even?

Breathlessly waiting (I just got done running upstairs ;) )
Sherry

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  #14  
Old 07-27-2006, 02:55 PM
David Jacklin (dj)
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Default Hi, Sherry: I'd love to

Hi, Sherry:

I'd love to share the music but The Secret Garden is under copyright and even posting a midi file of one of the numbers could get Mark into trouble. ASCAP and BMI are eagle-eyed these days. The work I did on the show was under license.

What's your feeling, Mark?

David

P.S. As an alternative, here's a song I'm working on at the moment, or rather that I wrote thirty years ago or . . .

My son is playing keyboards in a band at the moment (doing Yes and Led Zepellin and The Who) and I've been nudged to think back to my band days in the mid-70s. We wrote some originals but I'd forgotten all about them until I heard the young lads playing some progressive rock. There were lyrics to this, but I can't remember them other than the title hook!

<center><table border=1><tr><td>Sail On By
Sail On By in D 1.not (480.1 k)</td></tr></table></center>
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  #15  
Old 07-27-2006, 08:01 PM
Sherry Crann (sherry)
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Default Howdy David, Ah.... ok, we&

Howdy David,

Ah.... ok, we'll let you slide

So are you reworking this one for performance?

ttfn,
Sherry

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  #16  
Old 07-28-2006, 02:31 PM
David Jacklin (dj)
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Default Hi, Sherry: Well, I don'

Hi, Sherry:

Well, I don't have a rock band anymore, so I'd be performing it myself. I did have it in the back of my mind that my son's band might be interested in it.

They just did their first "adult" gig last night: an open mic night at a local pub, where some pretty heavy-weight regional pros often show up to do new material. They bowled people over, especially when they found out that the band consists of 15 and 16 year olds!

To hear my son ripping out, note for note, the Rick Wakeman organ and synth parts for Roundabout is pretty amazing. They're each working up a solo spot right now and Sean has decided on Emerson, Lake and Palmer's Hoedown: six and a half minutes of Hammond organ and Moog synthesizer.

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  #17  
Old 07-28-2006, 02:33 PM
David Jacklin (dj)
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Default P.S. And, yes, Composer doe

P.S.

And, yes, Composer does play a part in this. Sean is using it to work out his parts and is starting to write some original songs, using Composer.

David
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