Notation Software Users Forum  


Go Back   Notation Software Users Forum > Musician community sharing > Using Notation Software products with other (third party) products

Using Notation Software products with other (third party) products Find out from others, or share your experience, about integrating Notation Software products with sound libraries, audio processing software, and other hardware and software products.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 04-03-2007, 10:41 AM
Clyde (clyde)
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Hi Mark & other GPO gurus,

Hi Mark & other GPO gurus,
My wife is kindly playing some piano music on our keyboard for me, and I am transferring the midi file to Composer, and then seeking to revoice the piano sound using the GPO Steinway piano's.

What I am finding is that output seems to have some other sound behind it, and not just the Steinway. This can be heard in the following simple test sample which I have converted to an MP3 file:

<center><table border=1><tr><td>SampleMP3
Test.mp3 (176.0 k)</td></tr></table></center>

The NOT file I am using for this sample is:

<center><table border=1><tr><td>NOT file
Test.not (11.0 k)</td></tr></table></center>

What I have checked so far is:
(a) My Midi configuration in Composer and eveything looks OK
(b) If I play the same file through other sound cards (eg Roland Virtual sound card) I do not get the same problem
(c) Even if I delete all other midi interfaces and just leave the GPO one, I still get the same problem.

What am I doing incorrectly? Does anyone else have the same problem?

Any suggestions welcome?

Looking forward to your help ....

Clyde
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 04-03-2007, 01:37 PM
Sherry Crann (sherry)
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Howdy Clyde, From the mp3 a

Howdy Clyde,

From the mp3 above, it sounds like perhaps the Ambience reverb setting is probably higher than what you want. You certainly won't get that amount of reverb on any MIDI hardcard sounds, and only in very few soundfonts.

You can adjust how much reverb you have in GPO playback by clicking the Ambience icon in the lower right corner of Studio. You can choose to have no Ambience, or you can choose from a variety of presets (concert hall, club, etc.) as well as tweak your own settings.

If you use just the player to preview instruments, you can hear the difference that reverb makes by loading the "wet audition" Steinway (ton o' reverb) or the "dry" Steinway (no reverb). The difference is very distinct.

It could be something altogether different, that I'm not hearing in the compressed format. But the reverb issue is my best guess.

ttfn,
Sherry
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 04-03-2007, 01:51 PM
Clyde (clyde)
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Hi Sherry, Thanks for the

Hi Sherry,
Thanks for the suggestions.

Re the reverb, I have 'none'. The latest version of the Studio allows you to have 'none' whereas earlier versions (and yours may be like this) there did not appear to be that option, but only what you suggest of turning it all down.

In regard to just playing the notes on the GPO keyboard, if I do that, it all sounds fine, and that extra sound is not there. It only comes when I try to play it through Composer. It sounds as if there is another instrument in the background playing the same notes. (I checked to make sure I had no midi thru's)

Then again, it could just be my ears - maybe I'm the one with 'ringing in my ears' but then I don't get it with other piano sounds like the Roland Virtual Sound Canvas.

I would be interested if you can hear the sound in the MP3 I sent you, and also, if you could record the short piece in your GPO system and send me the MP3 file (I compressed in Audacity at 128). Then I could see if you have the same problem, or in fact it is my ears.

with thanks ...

Clyde
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 04-03-2007, 01:55 PM
Fred Winterling (harbor1)
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Hi Clyde, I played the file w

Hi Clyde,
I played the file with various ambience settings, and it sounds like you may it set to 'Concert Hall'. I agree with Sherry. That is probably the problem.
Cheers,
Fred
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 04-03-2007, 02:25 PM
Sherry Crann (sherry)
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Howdy Clyde, I also have th

Howdy Clyde,

I also have the Studio 2.0, which has the "no Ambience" option. I think I may have figured out the problem. You can load two different versions of the Steinway - one is "dry" and the other is the "wet audition" that I mentioned above. I did the following for the following two recordings:

1. Opened your .not file in Composer 2.0.4.
2. Opened Garritan Studio 2.0
3. Clicked the Ambience icon and made sure my Ambience setting was on "no".
4. Loaded the "dry" Steinway grand.
5. Played the file in Composer while recording with Audacity. This is that recording:

<center><table border=1><tr><td>Dry piano without reverb
SAC-dry-no-reverb.mp3 (158.4 k)</td></tr></table></center>

6. Leaving all settings the same, I then loaded the "wet audition" version of the Steinway, replacing the "dry" in the same slot.
7. Played the file in Composer while recording with Audacity. This is that recording:

<center><table border=1><tr><td>Wet piano without reverb
SAC-wet-no-reverb.mp3 (169.3 k)</td></tr></table></center>

I think if you try loading the "Dry" instrument patch, you'll find that you don't hear that "ringing in your ears" It also gives you more control for adding in just a touch of reverb with Ambience, to give a more "live room" feeling to the performance.

ttfn,
Sherry
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 04-03-2007, 02:28 PM
Fred Winterling (harbor1)
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Hi Clyde, Here is my mp3 file

Hi Clyde,
Here is my mp3 file. The ambience is set to "ballroom". I probably should have set it to "parlor". Let me know if you hear a difference. I only heard the reverb in the mp3, but did not hear any extra sound. My old ears have been starting to go south, so I could be missing what you are hearing.
Cheers,
Fred<center><table border=1><tr><td>
ClydeTest.mp3 (200.7 k)</td></tr></table></center>
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 04-03-2007, 04:00 PM
Clyde (clyde)
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Hi Fred & Sherry, Thank

Hi Fred &amp; Sherry,
Thanks for the samples - I cannot hear the additional sound in the samples you sent.

I am puzzled by your comment Sherry 'sure my Ambience setting was on "no".' Where do you set the amience to 'No'. There is no 'NO' button only a 'none'.

I had a look at the Garritan site, and they indicated there is a new Kontakt player (version 1.1.8.003 - I have 1.0.2.008). I downloaded and installed, but the Studio does not seem to want to load the newer version, so I'm somewhat stuck. (I even reloaded Studio, but still no success).

(I think I have an mental blockage about the Garritan software - I seem to have serious trouble everytime I try to do something. Last time is was all the security system).

Anyway, its late at night here (11pm) so thanks for the suggestions, I shall try them out again with a clearer head in the morning.

Cheers ... Clyde
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 04-03-2007, 04:20 PM
Sherry Crann (sherry)
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Howdy Clyde, Re. Ambience s

Howdy Clyde,

Re. Ambience setting to "no" - that was my mistake. I should have said "none", as you did. I've had some other little boys to join mine last night and today for a sleepover, and probably "no" was stuck in my head ;)

I also just checked my versions, and my Kontakt version is the newest one (1.1.8.003), and my Studio is also (2.0). I don't know if that has anything to do with it or not, but I don't think it would.

One other thought occurs to me as well. I know that for my sound card, I have "Environment effects" that I can use. I don't generally have these turned on, because I've noticed that some of these effects can have an adverse affect on how some of my audio devices playback. If you have such settings on your soundcard (mine is an SB Audigy 2), you may want to set it to "no effects" and see if that clears up the problem you're hearing.

ttfn,
Sherry
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 04-04-2007, 02:32 PM
Clyde (clyde)
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Hi Fred & Sherry, Than

Hi Fred &amp; Sherry,
Thanks to both of you for your help, but even my attempts at reloading the software ended up in being bigger than I expected.

So have gone on another path to solve the problem of revoicing the keyboard playing, and that seems to be giving a good result.

So I now have a solution, my wife is happy too with the result (and that is all that matters).

Cheers ... Clyde
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 04-04-2007, 03:08 PM
Sherry Crann (sherry)
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Howdy Clyde, So what was yo

Howdy Clyde,

So what was your path? Inquiring minds, ya know, as well as the fact that it could help someone else who has the same experience.

Also, just for the record, I'm still not clear what the "other sound" was that you were hearing in your recording. It really sounded like just a permutation of the reverb effect to me.

ttfn,
Sherry
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 04-05-2007, 12:44 AM
Clyde (clyde)
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Hi Sherry, I have a friend

Hi Sherry,
I have a friend who was (now retired) the piano tuner for all the concerts in the Melbourne (Australia) concert Hall and also the tuner for the ABC (our national radio) recordings. He indicated that before any great pianist would perform, they would line up all the grand pianos that they concert hall had, and the pianist would pick the one that suited best their style and sound expectations.

Well I did something like that with my wife. I got all the piano sound modules I could readily find, created an MP3 file of each piano from the midi file of her playing and let her pick the one she was most comfortable with.

Besides the Garritan GPO pianos, the others that I used were the normal PC midi piano, the Roland VSC, plus the ones from Europe that come with the 'virtual singer' I use, ( see http://www.myriad-online.com/cgi-bin...ng=EN&amp;id=8 ).

I also have my eye on another piano sound set from the Hamburg Steinway D concert grand piano located at the Krannert Center for the Performing Arts in Champaign, Illinois (see http://www.milandigitalaudio.com/steinway.htm ) that works in conjunction with the organ sound sets that I have. The demos are great, but I've been caught before with demos that seem impossible for us mere mortals to reproduce. So I'm negotiating about how to have a 'trial version'.

So having made up about 15 MP3 files of the same piece of my wife's playing, she then chose the one she liked best. Surprisingly, the Roland VSC (that comes with BIAB)was the best for her type of playing and music style (I emphasize that is was best for her style etc - maybe not the best for other styles).

This is good for me, as it is the easiest to use, works directly from a midi file ex Composer, and generates a 'wav' file without the need for going through the computer sound card.

Hope that helps ....
Clyde
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 04-05-2007, 01:22 AM
Sherry Crann (sherry)
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Howdy Clyde, Thanks for the

Howdy Clyde,

Thanks for the explanation, the sources, and the advice (to try out different sound sources and use the one that works best for your style and taste.) Good stuff all around

ttfn,
Sherry
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 04-05-2007, 01:34 PM
Clyde (clyde)
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Default Hi Sherry, Of course, none

Hi Sherry,
Of course, none of this is set in concrete. I'm sure there will be new sound fonts becoming available that are compatible with Composer.

They could change our view of what is best for our particular need.

Cheers ... Clyde
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 11:28 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Notation Software Germany GmbH www.notation.com/Imprint.php