Cannot set First Measure Number to zero
 

In Notation Composer 2.6 I could set the First Measure Number to Zero - but in Notation Composer 3 the First Measure Number has to be greater than Zero.

This is a pain becuase in some of the choral scores that I enter there is a pick-up measure which the publisher has effectively marked as Measure 0. The result now is that the measure numbers in my Notation 3 scores for such pieces are one more than the measure number printed in the original score, which is confusing to my choir members.

Can you tell me if my understanding is correct and, if so, is this a deliberate change intended to address a different requrement?

I have also tried opening a Notation Composer 2.6 file with the first measure set to Zero in Notation Composer 3. The file opens and plays and I can navigate to measure number 0 with the "qgm" command, but if I go to the Measure Numbers command it gives me an error message saying that the first measure must be greater than zero.

I haven't investigated if this might also cause a problem trying to open a First Measure Zero file in Notation Reader 3: this would be an additional problem for me.

Thanks
Tim

Re: Cannot set First Measure Number to zero
 

Hi Tim,

Sorry for the inconvenience to you, but this was indeed a deliberate change that was necessary to correct some other issues.
On opening this dialog as well as in some other measure editing procedures you'll run into error messages telling you that the measure numbering needs to be changed.

Notation Player is still at version 2.6.3 so it should not present a problem there at this point in time. Since Player is just a reader, and the issues associated with the measure numbering were in adding/editing, Player is not affected.

ttfn,
Sherry

Re: Cannot set First Measure Number to zero
 

Sherry

Thanks very much for the rapid reply. So just to clarify, for my limited purposes I should be able to adopt the following approach -

1. create the file in Notation 3 as usual

2. copy it to my laptop which is presently still running 2.6.3

3. set the First Measure Number to zero

4. copy back to the dekstop running Notation 3

5. create the files emphasised for each part

Can you see any issues in that approach?

Tim

Re: Cannot set First Measure Number to zero
 

Hi Tim,

I think your listed approach should work ok as long as you've done all the measure-related editing prior to bringing the file back into v3 for just the volume emphasis changes.

Of course if you do run into any problems, do let us know.

Good luck!
Sherry

Re: Cannot set First Measure Number to zero
 

Hi,

You can blame me. Many years ago, I had suggested to Mark Walsen, the founder and developer of Notation Composer and related products, to allow measure numbers to be zero or negative, for the reason Tim is interested in, but also for making any Intro not count as part of the main structure.

I mostly arrange orchestral music. The first thing I do is always to mark out the structure of a song. The Intro is really not part of the main structure. Sadly several Commands, that had not been changed for the new numbering system, introduced errors. In Composer 3, The first measure is always measure number 1.

Cheers,

Herbert

Re: Cannot set First Measure Number to zero
 

So now that I have updated both of my machines to Composer 3 and ditched Composer 2 to avoid confusion, I am faced with this problem again.

Just working on a purchased choral piece which starts with measure 0 (zero) and I have to produce a piano reduction for our accompanist which has ended up with different measure numbers to those showing in the original printed score. Bound to cause a certain amount of confusion between our conductor and our accompanist.

Is this anywhere on a reuqested features list or should I assume it is a permanent constraint of Composer that I cannot have a measure zero?

Thanks
Tim

Re: Cannot set First Measure Number to zero
 

Hi,

By itself, it may not be too difficult to program Composer to use zero and negative numbers for measure numbers. The problem may be more about priorities of what must be done next, to improve Composer for everybody. I fear that the problem of measure numbering is very low on the priority list.

I think that the measure numbering system is most fundamental. It should be looked at with some urgency. Other systems are possible, using letterers and numbers below measure 1.

Best wishes

Herbert.

Re: Cannot set First Measure Number to zero
 

Herbert

Thanks for the reply. I completely understand about prioritisation: for some years I worked for a small software company and we had precisely the same problem. I have no idea if this is an issue for any other users as Composer is used for such a wide range of purposes, and I quite accept that if I am a lone voice then it will fall off the bottom of the list.

Worth raising though as either others who do find it a problem will support the issue or there may be someone who can suggest a workaround.

Would be good to find some solution as we are a choir of 40 singers and the thought of altering 40 copies of a score for measure numbers gives me a bad headache.

I guess what I might have to do is to leave any Composer score unnumbered and then write in the measure numbers after printing.

The only problem that leaves me is that sometimes we split the choir and I take the men off to a room where we do not have an accompanist so use Notation as a rehearsal aid meaning it would be a challenge to jump back to a measure if the internal numbering system does not match the score.

Tim

Re: Cannot set First Measure Number to zero
 

Hi guys,

Actually it will take a substantive effort for the programming aspect because of how other areas (eg. regions) are set up. However, we do have it on the "to do" list but it won't make it into the next 3.0.3 release.

One way that I work around this issue with my own scores is to use Rehearsal Marks and not showing measure numbers. I put the "desired" measure number in a Rehearsal mark every so often (eg. at the beginning of each new section or phrase of music), and then use those to reference location. You can use the keyboard shortcut "qgr" (quick go rehearsal) to go to a given Rehearsal mark in the score quickly if you're using Composer as your "band". This also lets you sync your scores with any accompanist you may have as well.

Of course if you have other Rehearsal Marks already set, it's not so useful ;)

Hope this helps for the interim!

ttfn,
Sherry

Re: Cannot set First Measure Number to zero
 

Hi,

I think, until measure numbering is improved, Tim is better off to run Composer 2.6.3 just for the rehearsals and for printing the sheet music. Both versions of Composer can be run on one computer, if each version is in a separate folder and some care is taken not to get confused. Critical points in the music, that need special attention, are often found out only at the rehearsal.

Best wishes,

Herbert